*This blog was at blogger from 2009 to 2024, but it was time to move. The new home has all your favorite blogs from this site, but more categorized and easier to find. See you over at ScienceSexAndTheLadies.com
I thought some of you might be wondering what the world's most well-known living psychologist has to say about the female orgasm. So, because I care, I googled "dr. phil female orgasm," and immediately found his female orgasm page. It kinda sucks, but it's also kinda not the most craziest or outta wack advice. It's pretty close to what a lot of others are saying, but I will say it has a bit more emphasis than usual on the 'your lack of orgasm is definitely a personal problem' situation, which is fairly annoying. I'll let him talk, though.
Research shows that 90 percent of the problems women have in achieving orgasm stem from a psychological nature. That's good news because it's all about you and it can be overcome. Dr. Phil offers the following advice:
If you can achieve an orgasm alone, but not with a partner, you may have performance anxiety.
Being anxious, worried or feeling pressured to have an orgasm with your partner can work against you. Anxiety is an arousal response — it can cause tension. An orgasm is a relaxation response. Those two are incompatible.
If you're wondering, "Am I doing this right? Is he judging me? Is he having fun? Does he like this?" during intercourse, the anxiety can take you away from your pleasure.
Give yourself permission to change your internal dialogue. Say, "You know what? I am part of this exchange and I do have the right to ask for what I want. And I don't have to have expectancies that I have to perform in some way. I'm going to enjoy this." Give yourself permission to relax and go with the flow.
Okay, so let me just make a couple quick points:
Wouldn't put money on the '90% of women's orgasm problems are psychological' thing. There's no citations here, and I'm just gonna be frank - it really doesn't make much sense.
It's bullshit to jump straight to personal psychological issues. Women as a whole engage in an unfortunately ridiculous amount of sexual interactions that in no way involve stimulating their main organ of sexual pleasure - the clit. It's a reality that would seem simply preposterous if it were switched. Men having as many sexual acts that don't involve their penis as women do that don't involve their clit is unheard of. Given that there is clearly a widespread and under-discussed problem associated with not stimulating the appropriate genital areas, maybe that should be the most prominently considered thing on websites about helping women achieve orgasm.
Still, there is an important psychological element that needs to be considered, but I would argue a huge component of that stems from the above problem about too much sex with too little clit lovin'. Women do engage in a lot of sex throughout their lives that doesn't involve orgasm, so it is not crazy to think that female bodies learn to become aroused during sexual interactions with much more trepidation than male bodies. I mean if your body and mind only associate the beginning parts of sex with an eventual orgasm 70%, 50%, 30% of time or less, then the mind and body might start associating sex with a chore instead of something that is sexually arousing. Where there is no arousal, there is no orgasm, so psychologically training yourself to start associating sex with sexual arousal again could be important, but let's be clear here - that would include beginning to have physically more arousing sex on a more every-single-time kinda basis than was being had before, so the physical element is still quite important.
I agree that anxiety takes away from pleasure. In particular, anxiety can inhibit the physical process of sexual arousal, and since the orgasm is a release of the muscle tension and blood pooling brought on by arousal, then no arousal, no orgasm. Also, his second statement about anxiety, arousal, orgasm and relaxation uses those words in really confusing ways. Although I think I understand what was meant by it, and it seems fine, I would just ignore that one.
I completely agree that giving one's self permission to enjoy sex, to really be part of the activities, and to ask for what one wants is super important. I also love the idea that one should rid themselves of expectancies about performing a certain way. Love it. However, I really think all of that advice turns into useless shit if there is not proper understanding among both people about how women orgasm and about how huge of a wall our culture has created blocking that understanding.
I'd say that first one this way. If you can achieve an orgasm alone, but not with a partner, it's probably because you are rubbing your clitoral/vuvla area when you masturbate and getting your vagina boned when you have sex.
Dr. Phil's statements are followed by information from a few other sources, and actually there's a bit more talk about the importance of the clit there. However, as with pretty much all sex advice, taken all together it seems like the clit is just an extra thing that the unlucky among us must utilize to get the orgasms we should be getting from our vag's - and that's bullshit.
Can we talk about Jenny Block for a minute? She's so fucking on-point, and I feel terrible I haven't written specifically about her yet on this blog. Honestly, I've been meaning to write about her for a long time. I have links to some of her stuff sitting in my random drafts of blog posts. She's deemed an Orgasm Equality Hero on the ol' list I keep, but the truth is I haven't delved into a lot of her stuff yet.
However, I recently had an email interaction with her where I contacted her out of the blue about something and she wrote me right back, and was super nice. So, it reminded me I should write a post, and as I started digging around on her, I got as over the moon as I was when I first came across Sophia Wallace and her Cliteracy work. Jenny Block is bold about telling women that vaginal penetration does not a lady-gasm make. Unlike way too many other sexperts out there, she is not kinda demure and wishy-washy about it either. She's not like, "Well, most women need clitoral stimulation, but you know, every woman's different," and then goes on to talk about how doggy style is great for orgasming because the g-spot getting rammed hard enough or something like that. She's very strong in her conviction that we need to change the way we understand sex and women's place in it. She's pushin' this revolution, ya'll! I updated her entry in the Orgasm Equality Heroes list too, cause I found even better stuff.
So, since there's so much great stuff from her, I decided to list out 10 bitchin' things that Jenny Block's done to contribute to the New Sexual Revolution, Orgasm Equality, Cliteracy, and generally better sexual times for the ladies!
1This video that was created as part of the Huffington Post Interactive Cliteracy project.
I had seen her name before, but this is where she first really caught my eye. She's giving you the chapter of sex ed that you didn't get the first time around. One, she's a true blue collaborator with Cliteracy, so that's a plus. Two, quite accurate lines like:
"While the vagina is the female reproductive organ, the clit is the female sex organ."
Sex Education: The Missing Chapter from The Huffington Post on Vimeo. 2She wrote a whole book about masturbation called Solo Sex: All You Need To Know About Masturbation.
I'll be honest. I haven't read it...yet...I only have so many hours in the day, but she had me at 'masturbation.' Anyone who advocates for masturbation is a friend of mine. It gets such a bad rap. And, there's not a lot of masturbation books out there. Betty Dodson created a kick-ass one back in the day, but not many since. So thanks, Ms. Block, for giving us a modern Masturbation bible.
3 This interview on HuffPost Live with Caroline Modarressy-Tehrani where Ms. Block debunks common myths about female orgasm.
It's a good one, and she says lovely things like the following:
"If you're just doing a little bit of the ol' in and out, you're probably nowhere near the clit., and so, sex that is designed to put sperm inside of the woman's body is not necessarily designed for a woman to have an orgasm, and yet we we keep having that sex and having that sex. And I get emails all the time from women saying, 'what's wrong with me that I can't come from penetrative sex,' and I say nothing, nothing, nothing is wrong with you, but there may be something wrong with the way you're having sex."
4The fact that she was chillin' with the badest-ass orgasm equality hero and masturbation advocate lady I can think of - Betty Dodson.
"Having an orgasm is like going on a scavenger hunt. You look everywhere possible for it and you don't worry about how strange the places you need to look might be."
She talks about how you should sound however you need to sound, move however you need to move, think whatever you need to think, and take whatever time you need to take. This is so important because, as she also discusses, the depicted female orgasms and sex we often see is unrealistic, and we ought not try to emulate those or feel bad if we are doing things that don't seem normal.
This is the kind of realistic advice I'd like to see more of.
6For the flip side...this list of 11 Myths We Have To Stop Believing About The Female Orgasm
I particularly loved Myths 9 and 10. She got into the subtlety about why positions might matter to orgasm, and...be still my heart...she didn't pussyfoot around about 99,9% of women needing clitoral stimulation in order to orgasm.
Myth #9: Position makes no difference when it comes to female orgasm.Position makes all the difference when it comes to orgasm, but not for the reasons you might think. It is unlikely that a woman will come from penetration alone. If she does, it will be because everything prior to that was stellar, the penetration was well-timed, and the position allows for clitoral stimulation either directly or indirectly.
Myth #10: Penetration is the key for a woman to reach orgasm. Intercourse alone usually does not lead to orgasm. Twenty-five percent of women say they can consistently orgasm via penetration alone. Even that number may be high; most likely, those women who reported orgasm from penetration alone were experiencing some level of clitoral stimulation from the thrusting. I would argue instead that 99.9 percent of women need clitoral stimulation if they are going to reach orgasm. There are always the outliers. But we're talking about the rule here, not the exception.
7 This interview with Josh Zepp at HuffPost live in which she lays this shit down, for real with quotes like:
"If the clit's not involved, no one's coming, nobody, I mean nobody...that's just how a woman's body works."
and she also, quite rightly, keeps it sensitive, thoughtful, and non-blamey when it comes to the ambivalence and sometimes lack of interest displayed by some men when it comes to female orgasm...and points a finger at our deeply ingrained sexual culture
"you know, to be honest I don't really blame individual men for that. I sorta blame our overview of the way we've been treating sex all along. I mean considering what's thought of as being sex, which is intercourse - which doesn't really do it for most women in terms of orgasm - it's no wonder that we've gotten to this point."
8 She wrote The book O Wow: Discovering Your Ultimate Orgasm:
Well, I haven't read this one yet either, but I will recommend it sight unseen given all the other writing she's done and the things she's said in interviews. Plus I appreciate the emphasis on women owning their own orgasm in the book blurb.
"No matter how much your partner is committed to your orgasm, you are the only one who can and should be responsible for your orgasm."
9 This article giving Jenny Block's book a bad review...because it just makes me see more that I would probably love it.
So, the article is not complimentary of O Wow: Discovering Your Ultimate Orgasm, but the type of critique and what was critiqued only confirmed for me that this book is largely right on point and is strangely poignant about why advice like Block's is important and hard for people to hear. In fact, the main criticism is actually something I've found to be a favorite retort to any discussion about women being on an unequal playing field when it comes to our orgasms:
"I’m not sure how — given decades of Cosmo articles, sex manuals and the internet — Ms. Block has somehow convinced herself (and her publisher) that the vast majority of women are still walking around in total ignorance of their twats and how to use them."
I other words, this article dismissed the book immediately with: 'There is no problem. Women don't need anything more than we already have. Why are you even talking about this?' I hear that all the time in so many different ways, but the strange part is that actually, yes, tons of women are still walking around in total ignorance of their twats and how to use them, and if the writer of this critique can't see that, then she's clearly not seeing what I am seeing. She and I have a very different perspective, 'cause I would argue that things like Cosmo and internet advice are part of the reason women are walking around so ignorant. Those are not things that generally have the kind of accurate and honest information that could eliminated this problem, as the critic seems to suggest.
Like I said, this critic is not alone. I hear that comeback a lot, and it's hard because the orgasm inequality problem, for so many reasons, is kinda invisible, and it makes extra work to point out the problem before one can start in on solutions or be taken seriously.
I'm sure the author of this critique is a nice women with good intentions, and she probably has great and mutually orgasmic sex with her partner, but I think maybe the feeling that all women are like her got in the way of seeing that the advice in the book could help a lot of people. I think she was just turned off from the beginning, which is too bad, because I think it was pretty clear that she agrees that women deserve to be in orgasmic mutually satisfying relationships just like Jenny does. Maybe they'll get some common ground eventually, but for now, it made me feel like Jenny Block's book is rocking the boat in the right way.
"You want to know why women aren't sexually satisfied? It's because they are having procreative sex for recreation. It's because they are getting a little bit of the old "in and out" and not having orgasms because the old "in and out" doesn't lead to female orgasm. It's because they have been participating in the same activity hoping for a different result but not getting it. It's the definition of insanity. Ask Einstein."
If every time you went to the ice cream store, you ordered, waited in line, were handed your order, and had it taken away before you could taste it, how many times would you keep going back before you would finally lose interest in going out for ice cream?
Women have lost interest in sex because the sex they are having doesn't take their interests to heart.
and then a little later in the article
Yes, depression and aging and hormones and lifestyle all play a part in female sexual dysfunction. But before we start diagnosing everything else, before we start prescribing a pill, let's get to a little truth-telling first. Let's ask the real questions, the hard questions -- What are you calling sex? How are you having sex? When are you having sex? How much attention is really being paid to her pleasure? Is her clit 100 per cent involved, 100 per cent of time? Are you both cliterate?
So, I was googling "Lady Orgasm" just to see what might pop up to quickly write about - cause, hey, you never know what "Lady Orgasm" might bring you. And, seriously, I need to get a post up quick cause I ain't got the time right now, ya'll. Anyway, Columbia University has a site called Columbia Health, and there is section called Go Ask Alice! that answers peoples (probably mostly student's) health questions. Well, the first page of my google search took me to a grouping of these questions originally published in 2001 about women not feeling much from vaginal intercourse. Here are the questions.
(1)Dear Alice,I am a sexually
active female, but I can't reach orgasm when having sex with my boyfriend. Can
you help me out? Thanks.— Yearning(2)Hello Alice,I am 28 years
old. I've had a problem for years now; well, I had this problem all my life and
I was too ashamed to seek help. Here it goes: during sexual intercourse, I
never feel any sensation or tingling feelings, I feel nothing. I can feel the
penis, but that is all. This has been with every guy I've been with and I've
been with about 15 guys. I'm currently dating this guy for five years. I love
him, but during sex, I feel nothing. He turns me on, and I get aroused, but
when it comes to actually having sex, I feel NOTHING. It's like I have a
disjunction in my vagina. Does it have something to do with my clitoris? What
is wrong with me? Please, can you tell me? I will eventually see a doctor, but
I just want to know, what is the problem with me? Please, I would really
appreciate it, I've kinda learned to live with it. Sad, right? :)— C(3)Dear Alice,Yet again,
another question about intercourse and (female) orgasms. I am 25 and have been
having intercourse for about 1 1/2 years and have never experienced even the
remotest possibility of climaxing from intercourse. Intercourse does NOTHING
for me. I've read the Hite Report, I know it claims that only 30% of women
orgasm from intercourse alone; however, most women who say they don't orgasm
from intercourse say that they at least receive some arousal or stimulation or
pleasure from the sensation--it just doesn't lead them to orgasm. However, I
have never received the SLIGHTEST sexual pleasure from intercourse--and it's
making me so unhappy and desperate that I feel I'm going insane.— Searching for
pleasure(4)Dear Alice,What is the best
way for a woman with an inaccessible clitoris to reach orgasm during
intercourse, without artificial stimulation?
So Alice answers by basically telling them that the vagina doesn't have much nerve endings and that not much is going to happen if the clit isn't involved. She recommends working with one's partner to find ways to make the damn thing happen, trying woman-on-top positions for better freedom, adding sex toys, and reading up for more ideas - you know, that kind of thing.
Honestly, she gives a good answer, it's better than a lot I've seen but I just can't help but feel that we need more. Saying kinda softly to frustrated ladies that most women don't orgasm from vaginal stimulation, and that we should just explore more with our partners and that "if you are generally satisfied with your sexual activity, there is no need to be dismayed by your lack of vaginal sensation or feel pressured to feel pleasure or orgasm during intercourse," is nice and true, but man, it feels like bullshit. It feels like it's bullshit to even be having this discussion. It feels like this is bullshit that the women are the ones fretting about this "personal" issue when it should be our whole society fretting about how we could possibly have gone so long teaching and depicting female orgasm so incorrectly. It's bullshit, and we should be a little madder about it and a little more vocal. We, as a society, should be really hearing all these women asking questions about their orgasms and realizing that women as a whole are suffering because of this cultural ignorance.
Anyway, that's my 2 cents. And, ya know, I have talked to many people who say they didn't even know that people still worry about the whole vaginal orgasm vs. clitoral orgasm thing anymore, and they don't think it's much of an issue. I wonder sometimes, but then I see things like this that remind me women do struggle with this on the regular. Us ladies might not call it vag vs. clit issue. We might not even know about Freud saying clitoral orgasms were infantile. We just know about what society has made us feel is normal, and then we have to somehow make that fit with what we actually feel in our bodies. We all find different ways to deal with it, but it all stems from the fact that vaginal orgasms are deeply ingrained in us as normal and/or highly desirable; that, oddly enough, female bodies (not some but as far as we know all female bodies) are not able to orgasm vaginally; and that no one seems to be screaming out about this insane discrepancy, so it's as if none of this is an issue at all - just women needing to figure out our own personal sexual struggles... It's bullshit.
However, like I said before, the answer HERE was good and more progressive than most, so it gets a 4 out of 5 vulva rating!
Hello there. A fantastic friend introduced me to Inside Amy Schumer, and I pretty much liked it a whole lot. It's pretty funny shit, and it's got that feminist edge, ya'll. I'm sure you've heard all that before since I'm apparently the last feminist on earth to suck her labes on my blog. However, you probably haven't read an SSL review of her on the Joe Rogan Experience podcast (if you have that would be insanity, so let me know about that). Charlie listens to it every once in a while, and after hearing her, he told me I probably needed to give it a listen and an SSL review. He was on point cause there was some good shit in there that made me want to kiss Amy Schumer's asshole even more.
If you don't know Joe Rogan, you probably don't watch UFC or aren't at an age or temperament where you watched him on News Radio or hosting Fear Factor. I actually didn't realize he is also a working stand-up comic, so that was new to me. He's a dude, through and though, but I find him kind of endearing. His podcasts are almost 3 hours, and sometimes, maybe often, everyone in the studio is high, so they can be pretty fun. Anyway, Amy was on 4 different podcasts, but I've only listened to the first 2. Here's the SSL review so far.
Episode 188
The part I want to bring up about this one involves Amy trying to call bullshit on a pretty common thing people spout off about. It started because Amy was telling a story about a douche bag dude that was working a comedy club that she was headlining, and he was acting all alpha-it-should-be-me-headlining the whole week, and part of that included him being extraordinarily loud while banging this waitress in the room next to her (They were in a comedy condo- which I guess are these crappy places where comedians can stay cheap/free? when they come into town to do a show). So her meaning while telling the story got all confused for a minute and Joe started talking about how dudes are just plain driven by sex, and either he or his producer Brian also said something like, "you just don't know what it's like to have a dick." So people talk like this all the time, like guys are so insanely driven by sex in a way that women couldn't possibly understand. Like there's some, girls-not-allowed, dick-having club where people are in touch with their seed-spreading, neanderthal, getting-off-above-all self. It's bullshit for many reasons (mostly because we base this very common idea off how women relate to intercourse and male focused sexual media and neither have much to do with women getting off at all - even though everyone acts like it does, but I digress. Watch my movie to hear more.)
Anyway, at the very least it's annoying - as a woman who feels driven by these same getting off urges but also knows that the urges don't quite fit into the male shaped box our culture has carved out for them - to hear that. The annoying part about it is not an easy explanation or even an explanation that most women feel equip to articulate, but it is annoying. I feel like Amy had at least a spark of this annoyance cause she was like, "I don't know, I think I'm driven by sex." She said it a couple different ways, and then the subject kind of changed, but I like that she spoke up even a little.
So I know that wasn't strictly SSL review material. It didn't specifically discuss or depict female sexual release or masturbation. However, I think it related so closely to our cultural misunderstanding of orgasm that I'm going to let it slide. Plus, I hate when people insinuate that women are just naturally incapable of understanding the male sex drive. It's bullshit.
I'm Episode 204
So this was her second time on the show. This part is directly related to female orgasm, and Amy knocks this out of the park, comedy-wise and in like a feminist existential kind of way, man. It was way deep because it kinda summed up what I think about 95% of ladygasm advice and discussion that exists out there in the world. It was pretty badass.
I've just transcribed the conversation below. Be aware that a lot of the lines are a bit over each other, so maybe read it like that or something. Also, I might have mixed up Brian and Joe's lines because they are hard to tell apart for me in some cases. Oh, and I might have added a couple comments in there.
Joe: Did you know that a lot of women are admitting now - there was a study done on it - that a lot of women are achieving orgasm during strenuous exercise. Amy: What? Brian (producer): Yeah, very common. A: That sounds great. What are they doing? B: looking at me J: I'll Google it here....study shows A: I was so sick in the hospital I haven't like masturbated in like a week. B: Really? A: Yeah, I like forgot about it. That's how sick I was. B: You haven't mutually masturbated with another guy like for real? A: Yes, of course.
Fucking A, Amy. Admitting to masturbation and mutual masturbation, gets you like extra points on the SSL review vulvameter.
J: That's just stupid. Why not just fuck? B: Yeah.
Not yeah. Mutual masturbation is THE BEST, and it's a much better way to get off for us ladies than a screwfest, so maybe take note Joe and Brian.
A: Well, I guess cause when you're together a long time you're trying to make things fun. J: Women have orgasms at the gym study shows.Wow, yeah that's really true. A: What are these women doing at the gym?...fucking their trainers. J: Findings add qualitative and quantitative data to a field that has been largely unstudied. A field? Yes! B: What really makes the vagina go pop pop pop? That's my field. I'm in the orgasm field. A field? Has women's orgasms been a field? J: It's largely unstudied according to Debby. Oh Debby you silly bitch. A: Oh Debby, always thinking about her clit, Clit deb. B: Debby probably loves pussy. J: Oh deb Debby probably has a fleshlight and she licks it sittin' in the office like woa woa... pussy is so awesome. This is my field. I'm doing research in my field. A: Debby's in the field you guys. She can't talk. J: Thank you for your work...Co-director of the Center for Sexual Health at Indiana University. For instance Alfred Kinsey and his colleagues first reported the phenomenon in 1953 saying that 5% of women they interviewed mentioned orgasm linked to physical exercise. Wow, that's fucking awesome for those 5 chicks. A: What is this Brian? J: The report of so-called coregasms named because of their seeming link to exercises for core abdominal muscles have circulated in the media for years according to researchers. So, apparently it's working your core. So getting on the knees and tightening up the pussy shit's real. B: Yeah J: So what you want to do is get on your knees, A: Okay J: and then I want you to rock your ass back to your heels, A: Okay J: and pull yourself up with your abs while you're squeezing your pussy. A: okay, why don't I just rub my clit. What?...Like why all the...why all the work?
Indeed, Amy, indeed. Why the fuck are we always being told about these great ladygasms that you have to get to from exercise or weird positions called things like Nancy's Twilight Reign or some shit like that? Why do we have to do things like slowly slide the puss down the cock then kinda corkscrew our body as we move up then let the dick pop out and slightly glide against the clit then go back down or some stupid complicated dumbass thing like that? Dudes get to just find a way to get their dick encompassed and rubbed. Simple. Can we not just get to a point where ladies can just find a way to get their clits rubbed. It's honestly, truly, for realz, that simple, and the fact that all this stupid complicated advice fills our culture, means we clearly don't know that yet.
5 out of 5 vulvas for you Ms. Schumer.
(!)(!)(!)(!)(!)
Who knew? I've never been a fan of the whole women are from venus, men are from mars thing. It always struck me as putting men and women into weird stereotypical buckets that didn't really coincide with my experiences of men and women. However I will give credit where credit is due. Lauren Gray from the MarsVenus website gave a fantastic answer to a question from "Marie." Check the full video and article HERE.
Hi Lauren, I am 33 years old and I’ve never had an orgasm during intercourse. What do I need to do to have one? Do I have a disability down there? -Maria
Long story short - Lauren tells Marie that the majority of women can't orgasm through g-spot stimulation; that she absolutely doesn't have a disability; that she, like most women, needs clitoral stimulation to orgasm; that asking a woman to orgasm just from intercourse was like asking a man to orgasm from stimulating his balls; that a dude isn't less of a man because his penis isn't what gets his lady off; and then, when she gives "sure fire" ways to orgasm during intercourse, I was overjoyed to find that they all relate to manually stimulating or vibe-ing the clit. That's straight up orgasm equality baller advice right there, Ms. Lauren Gray! Respect. Of course, you know me. I would probably harp on the idea that even though 30% of women claim to orgasm through vaginal penetration, it's probably a lot less than that (if at all) given that our culture uses the word "orgasm" to mean so many things, and given that there is actually no scientific documentation of a g-spot related orgasm (ejaculation, yes. orgasm, no), but that's me, and I'm kinda obsessed with that. However, simply keeping the focus on the clit when giving sex advice and not vaguely alluding to ways that a certain position or something could maybe allow hands-free intercourse to cause orgasm is so very rare in sex advice that this approach in itself is pretty radical. Rock on Lauren Gray. Oh I also like the comment from "tellmisty" on 12/30/2013
"Your penis might be THE most awesome penis of all time ..." LOL! I love it. Ahhh, Lauren, that's good stuff. A guy I was dating once had this unrealistic idea that his penis was his gift to me. I reached out one day and massaged his palm. "Does that feel good?" "Uh. Yeah." "That is what your penis feels like in my vagina. Just like that. Just ... that." His face ... was classic. I was so annoyed that he'd been with so many women and none of them had told the brother the truth about his penis, or more accurately, OUR VAJAYJAY. You know I beat around the bush (no pun intended) about it for weeks. The only path left: the straight-up DIRECT TRUTH. Now. I love penises. I do. But we need to put it all context, people!...
To which "Lauren Gray" replies on 1/1/2014
Hahaha. Thanks tellmisty for taking us all to school! ;-)
